Christianity QA » Christian God » rain
Question:
And finally — isn’t trying to control the weather going against something that a lot of Wiccans maintain — that it’s the Christians who think they have dominion over the Earth and can control it, whereas we live with nature? As for your final statement, about nature. I believe the goal of Wicca, is to master the elements, and this is done by living within nature, where as the Christian view point mentions nothing of mastering, only being protected from those forces. By building a Dam and holding back the water, you are not controling the element, by any means. Patrick Stewart
You make a good point. Part of mastery is the realisation that the more tightly one trys to control, the greater the probability of loosing all control (with disasterous results in the case of dams and leveys). I do weather work myself, and must allways keep the balance of weather in mind. Some days, there just isn’t any rain in the sky to call. Others, there’s so much that it’s pure folly to try to hold it back. Storms are as splendid and necessary as they are damaging. Hold back the rain too long, and you’ll get it all at once. Call it down for days on end and you’ll miss out on a clensing thunderstorm, or cause a drought for someone else. On the other hand, there’s no harm in holding rain off for a few hours, or getting it to go ahead and get it over with. Or even getting a break for a day so some of the flood waters can receed (if it’s not too dead set on it). Gilgemesh
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Let me guess, Doug, your not a Wiccan, but you probably read fantasy novels. You would like to believe all of what Michelle is saying to be true, only you believe science makes it otherwise. You have never practiced magic, you have never really read books about magic, and if you have, you’ve never really applied it, and then still, have never really gave it a chance. Action follows thought, is the key thing you should learn; just saying the words accomplishes nothing, just thinking about something does little, but with the desired actions and methods, magic is real, as real as science, when you understand how it works. If I knew where you lived, I’d take your challenge, huckle berry. Your a daisy if you do. Patrick Stewart
This thread reminds me of the guy on PODS claiming to be responsible for the storms that caused the Flood of "93. It was hilarious! He called himself Milo and was causing all the problems in an effort to kill his ex-wife. The Wiccan posters there were very displeased to say the least. 
Love and Light! Lunatic Fringe
Response:
: Overstreet) writes:
: y I beg your pardon, I wrote nothing of the sort! ;-) : Doesn’t controling weather go against the doctrine of "Harm none"? I think this is addressed to the wrong person. I have never asserted otherwise. Blessings, Natalie — *** I don’t speak for HP *** *** fight breast cancer *** WARNING! This is an UNCENSORED copy of Natalie’s signature! Transmitting this signature could be in violation of the Telecommunications Act of 1996. Free Speech Online Blue Ribbon Campaign: http://www.eff.org/blueribbon.html
Response:
: : Let me guess, Doug, your not a Wiccan, but you probably read fantasy novels. : Let me guess, Patrick, you have no basis for this assertion other : than mere disagreement. : Let me guess, Natalie, your still making pointless arguements, by picking : apart statements that are not worth arguing. On the contrary, I think that it’s appalling that one would discredit another’s religious beliefs on the basis of mere disagreement. Doug is not exactly an infrequent poster here; certainly, you have no ground by which to call him "not a *real* Wiccan" based solely on simple skepticism. : I know how you feel about Wicca; : if that’s what you’d like to call it. And your response to this question : would no doubt be: "Pointless, I don’t think so." Well, undoubtedly. : : You have never practiced magic, you have : : never really read books about magic, and if you have, you’ve never really : : applied it, and then still, have never really gave it a chance. : What if he has, hm? : Well, it doesn’t sound like he has, now does it, but then again, you don’t : practice magic either, so how would you know, either way? I don’t practice magic like *you* practice magic. Big difference. : Thanks for : pointing out that little tid bit of information. I really love answering : these blind questions. If anyone writes, on this internet, for mere sake of : arguing, that would be you. I only argue when I feel it’s necessary. It’s not as if I sit around and criticize *every* post that talks about magic, speaking with the gods, the Summerlands, or what have you. I don’t, because I feel that such issues are primarily a matter of belief. I generally save my arguments for folk who feel that anyone who disagrees with them is inferior. : : Action follows thought, is the key thing you should learn; just saying the : : words accomplishes nothing, just thinking about something does little, but : : with the desired actions and methods, magic is real, as real as science, when : : you understand how it works. If I knew where you lived, I’d take your : : challenge, huckle berry. Your a daisy if you do. : Why do you need to know where he lives? I’m sure that it would : be easy enough for us to follow the weather in New Brunswick. : Nothings changed, I guess. It would appear you have evolved little, since we : have last talked. Oh, my. If you only knew…. Haven’t you ever learned that ad hominem arguments are logically fallacious? : My final post for, "All religions teach us something, but : not all teach us the truth", should be sufficient once again, I trust you’ve : read it. I fail to see the relevance to the weather in New Brunswick, however. Why not answer the question? : It’s funny, I’ve got this mental image of you now in my head. Ditto. : It’s : much like those people I’ve met, while working with the public, I can’t say : I’m very impressed, but I’m sure you could really care anyways. "And, No, I’m : not psychic, yet; only guessing." At least you have the grace to admit it. It would seem that you *have* been learning lately. Blessings, Natalie — *** I don’t speak for HP *** *** fight breast cancer *** WARNING! This is an UNCENSORED copy of Natalie’s signature! Transmitting this signature could be in violation of the Telecommunications Act of 1996. Free Speech Online Blue Ribbon Campaign: http://www.eff.org/blueribbon.html
Response:
: Let me guess, Doug, your not a Wiccan, but you probably read fantasy novels. Let me guess, Patrick, you have no basis for this assertion other than mere disagreement.
Let me guess, Natalie, your still making pointless arguements, by picking apart statements that are not worth arguing. I know how you feel about Wicca; if that’s what you’d like to call it. And your response to this question would no doubt be: "Pointless, I don’t think so." : You have never practiced magic, you have : never really read books about magic, and if you have, you’ve never really : applied it, and then still, have never really gave it a chance. What if he has, hm?
Well, it doesn’t sound like he has, now does it, but then again, you don’t practice magic either, so how would you know, either way? Thanks for pointing out that little tid bit of information. I really love answering these blind questions. If anyone writes, on this internet, for mere sake of arguing, that would be you. : Action follows thought, is the key thing you should learn; just saying the : words accomplishes nothing, just thinking about something does little, but : with the desired actions and methods, magic is real, as real as science, when : you understand how it works. If I knew where you lived, I’d take your : challenge, huckle berry. Your a daisy if you do. Why do you need to know where he lives? I’m sure that it would be easy enough for us to follow the weather in New Brunswick.
Nothings changed, I guess. It would appear you have evolved little, since we have last talked. My final post for, "All religions teach us something, but not all teach us the truth", should be sufficient once again, I trust you’ve read it. It’s funny, I’ve got this mental image of you now in my head. It’s much like those people I’ve met, while working with the public, I can’t say I’m very impressed, but I’m sure you could really care anyways. "And, No, I’m not psychic, yet; only guessing." Patrick Stewart – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Natalie — *** I don’t speak for HP *** *** fight breast cancer *** WARNING! This is an UNCENSORED copy of Natalie’s signature! Transmitting this signature could be in violation of the Telecommunications Act of 1996. Free Speech Online Blue Ribbon Campaign: http://www.eff.org/blueribbon.html
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (Stuff deleted.) I really feel sorry for weathermen. They can’t possibly account for Witches. No wonder they’re often wrong. They’re right a lot more often than they’re wrong. Just in the past ten days the weather channel has correctly predicted ice, snow, clear skies, clouds, rain, warming trends, and bitter cold even for this notoriously "don’t like the weather, wait ten minutes" part of the country. If it says a high chance of rain, I take an umbrella to work. If it says sunny, I don’t. I almost never get wet unless I ignore a forecast for rain. Doug Let me guess, Doug, your not a Wiccan, but you probably read fantasy novels. Wrong on both counts, actually. You would like to believe all of what Michelle is saying to be true, only you believe science makes it otherwise. You have never practiced magic, you have never really read books about magic, and if you have, you’ve never really applied it, and then still, have never really gave it a chance. I wouldn’t "like to believe" either way. I approach magick with a skeptical, open mind. So far, no one has convinced me that it works. I’ve given it a chance; beyond meditation and self-help spells, I’ve seen no evidence that it works. I’ve been told "you have to believe it to see it". That goes against my (yes, scientific) mindset about the world. If you go in expecting it to work, you’ll be convinced that it does. If you go in with no preconceptions, if you ask "what about such-and-such a mundane explanation", there’s a big chance there won’t be any good counterarguments to your mundane explanations and you won’t be convinced of magick’s objective reality. Action follows thought, is the key thing you should learn; just saying the words accomplishes nothing, just thinking about something does little, but with the desired actions and methods, magic is real, as real as science, when you understand how it works. If I knew where you lived, I’d take your challenge, huckle berry. Your a daisy if you do. Patrick Stewart I’m a daisy? Recently I’ve been attending gatherings of magick-practicing friends. Seeing what they do has made me more, not less, skeptical that magick has any objective reality. It’s their spiritual belief, and I have no right to challenge that. But as for myself, a couple examples. In a circle of energy, I didn’t feel diddly. And witnessing ouija board work, it really seemed like whenever my friends asked a question that could have possibly led to a checkable, verifiable/falsifiable fact, the answer came back "I can’t tell you/don’t know". Fishy. Just like the existence of the Christian God, the objective reality of magick is something that could possibly be proven *very* easily. In the former case, He could come down and speak to the world. In the latter, well, since you mentioned it — I live in State College, PA, lat. 41 N, long. 77 W. If you can make it 75 degrees F and blue skies here tomorrow, I’ll be impressed and drop all my skepticism. No excuses like "it takes longer than that" — by next week it might be 75 F and sunny on its own. Even my friends who do practice admit to me that there’s no way to prove what they’re doing to someone like me who comes in with no preconceptions. So you see, show me evidence that it works, evidence convincing to someone who is sympathetic but skeptical, and I’ll believe you. Thus far, I’ve seen no such evidence. Until I do, I have to treat magick as a part of the spiritual world views of certain people, which does not appear to have a provable, objective reality. If you believe it works, fine — but it doesn’t for me, and until it becomes something that is observer-independent, the same for everyone, it is a part of the subjective world, not the objective one. And finally — isn’t trying to control the weather going against something that a lot of Wiccans maintain — that it’s the Christians who think they have dominion over the Earth and can control it, whereas we live with nature? Doug
You have a pretty good arguement here. Because you have not seen with your own eyes or have experienced anything to do with the occult, you remain skeptical. But to me; it doesn’t sound like you gave it your time and effort. It certainly doesn’t sound like you participated with in the circle. As for your final statement, about nature. I believe the goal of Wicca, is to master the elements, and this is done by living within nature, where as the Christian view point mentions nothing of mastering, only being protected from those forces. By building a Dam and holding back the water, you are not controling the element, by any means. Patrick Stewart
Response:
(Stuff deleted.) I really feel sorry for weathermen. They can’t possibly account for Witches. No wonder they’re often wrong. They’re right a lot more often than they’re wrong. Just in the past ten days the weather channel has correctly predicted ice, snow, clear skies, clouds, rain, warming trends, and bitter cold even for this notoriously "don’t like the weather, wait ten minutes" part of the country. If it says a high chance of rain, I take an umbrella to work. If it says sunny, I don’t. I almost never get wet unless I ignore a forecast for rain. Doug Let me guess, Doug, your not a Wiccan, but you probably read fantasy novels.
Wrong on both counts, actually. You would like to believe all of what Michelle is saying to be true, only you believe science makes it otherwise. You have never practiced magic, you have never really read books about magic, and if you have, you’ve never really applied it, and then still, have never really gave it a chance.
I wouldn’t "like to believe" either way. I approach magick with a skeptical, open mind. So far, no one has convinced me that it works. I’ve given it a chance; beyond meditation and self-help spells, I’ve seen no evidence that it works. I’ve been told "you have to believe it to see it". That goes against my (yes, scientific) mindset about the world. If you go in expecting it to work, you’ll be convinced that it does. If you go in with no preconceptions, if you ask "what about such-and-such a mundane explanation", there’s a big chance there won’t be any good counterarguments to your mundane explanations and you won’t be convinced of magick’s objective reality. Action follows thought, is the key thing you should learn; just saying the words accomplishes nothing, just thinking about something does little, but with the desired actions and methods, magic is real, as real as science, when you understand how it works. If I knew where you lived, I’d take your challenge, huckle berry. Your a daisy if you do. Patrick Stewart
I’m a daisy? Recently I’ve been attending gatherings of magick-practicing friends. Seeing what they do has made me more, not less, skeptical that magick has any objective reality. It’s their spiritual belief, and I have no right to challenge that. But as for myself, a couple examples. In a circle of energy, I didn’t feel diddly. And witnessing ouija board work, it really seemed like whenever my friends asked a question that could have possibly led to a checkable, verifiable/falsifiable fact, the answer came back "I can’t tell you/don’t know". Fishy. Just like the existence of the Christian God, the objective reality of magick is something that could possibly be proven *very* easily. In the former case, He could come down and speak to the world. In the latter, well, since you mentioned it — I live in State College, PA, lat. 41 N, long. 77 W. If you can make it 75 degrees F and blue skies here tomorrow, I’ll be impressed and drop all my skepticism. No excuses like "it takes longer than that" — by next week it might be 75 F and sunny on its own. Even my friends who do practice admit to me that there’s no way to prove what they’re doing to someone like me who comes in with no preconceptions. So you see, show me evidence that it works, evidence convincing to someone who is sympathetic but skeptical, and I’ll believe you. Thus far, I’ve seen no such evidence. Until I do, I have to treat magick as a part of the spiritual world views of certain people, which does not appear to have a provable, objective reality. If you believe it works, fine — but it doesn’t for me, and until it becomes something that is observer-independent, the same for everyone, it is a part of the subjective world, not the objective one. And finally — isn’t trying to control the weather going against something that a lot of Wiccans maintain — that it’s the Christians who think they have dominion over the Earth and can control it, whereas we live with nature? Doug
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was amazed at how incredibly easy it was to control the weather when I first did it. It was an expression of my own will rather than a ritualistic exercise. I wanted a beautiful clear day and I focused on the idea. The next day was perfect! Coincidence? Very likely. Back then I was rather doubtful so I thought it probably was. To prove that I hadn’t really done it, I repeated the action. Another beautiful day! Dispite repeated sucess, I didn’t really believe I could do it until I melted a cloud, something a friend and fellow witch told me about. If there are enough clouds in the sky, and you watch them for long enough, you’ll see one of them get smaller. I still didn’t really believe until I expanded another immediatelly after. And you’ll also see one of them get larger. Clouds tend to do that. Then I was hooked. I played around, making clear skies and rain until I was yelled at. How about if we submit this to an experiment: you stay in a closed room for a week, so that you don’t know what the weather is or what it’s likely to be in the near future. Then you do your "magic". Then we’ll test what you wish for with what actually happens. Don’t like that idea? The fact is, people get used to weather patterns and thus know when it’s about to rain or not, etc. Farmers and mariners have done this for thousands of years. Take the variable of knowing the present weather (and maybe the forecasts) out of your practice, I sincerely doubt you’d do better than random chance. But that’s a different story. I really feel sorry for weathermen. They can’t possibly account for Witches. No wonder they’re often wrong. They’re right a lot more often than they’re wrong. Just in the past ten days the weather channel has correctly predicted ice, snow, clear skies, clouds, rain, warming trends, and bitter cold even for this notoriously "don’t like the weather, wait ten minutes" part of the country. If it says a high chance of rain, I take an umbrella to work. If it says sunny, I don’t. I almost never get wet unless I ignore a forecast for rain. Doug
Let me guess, Doug, your not a Wiccan, but you probably read fantasy novels. You would like to believe all of what Michelle is saying to be true, only you believe science makes it otherwise. You have never practiced magic, you have never really read books about magic, and if you have, you’ve never really applied it, and then still, have never really gave it a chance. Action follows thought, is the key thing you should learn; just saying the words accomplishes nothing, just thinking about something does little, but with the desired actions and methods, magic is real, as real as science, when you understand how it works. If I knew where you lived, I’d take your challenge, huckle berry. Your a daisy if you do. Patrick Stewart
Response:
: Let me guess, Doug, your not a Wiccan, but you probably read fantasy novels. Let me guess, Patrick, you have no basis for this assertion other than mere disagreement. : You would like to believe all of what Michelle is saying to be true, only you : believe science makes it otherwise. Who wouldn’t? : You have never practiced magic, you have : never really read books about magic, and if you have, you’ve never really : applied it, and then still, have never really gave it a chance. What if he has, hm? : Action follows thought, is the key thing you should learn; just saying the : words accomplishes nothing, just thinking about something does little, but : with the desired actions and methods, magic is real, as real as science, when : you understand how it works. If I knew where you lived, I’d take your : challenge, huckle berry. Your a daisy if you do. Why do you need to know where he lives? I’m sure that it would be easy enough for us to follow the weather in New Brunswick. Blessed Be! Natalie — *** I don’t speak for HP *** *** fight breast cancer *** WARNING! This is an UNCENSORED copy of Natalie’s signature! Transmitting this signature could be in violation of the Telecommunications Act of 1996. Free Speech Online Blue Ribbon Campaign: http://www.eff.org/blueribbon.html
Response:
I was amazed at how incredibly easy it was to control the weather when I first did it. It was an expression of my own will rather than a ritualistic exercise. I wanted a beautiful clear day and I focused on the idea. The next day was perfect! Coincidence?
Very likely. Back then I was rather doubtful so I thought it probably was. To prove that I hadn’t really done it, I repeated the action. Another beautiful day! Dispite repeated sucess, I didn’t really believe I could do it until I melted a cloud, something a friend and fellow witch told me about.
If there are enough clouds in the sky, and you watch them for long enough, you’ll see one of them get smaller. I still didn’t really believe until I expanded another immediatelly after.
And you’ll also see one of them get larger. Clouds tend to do that. Then I was hooked. I played around, making clear skies and rain until I was yelled at.
How about if we submit this to an experiment: you stay in a closed room for a week, so that you don’t know what the weather is or what it’s likely to be in the near future. Then you do your "magic". Then we’ll test what you wish for with what actually happens. Don’t like that idea? The fact is, people get used to weather patterns and thus know when it’s about to rain or not, etc. Farmers and mariners have done this for thousands of years. Take the variable of knowing the present weather (and maybe the forecasts) out of your practice, I sincerely doubt you’d do better than random chance. But that’s a different story. I really feel sorry for weathermen. They can’t possibly account for Witches. No wonder they’re often wrong.
They’re right a lot more often than they’re wrong. Just in the past ten days the weather channel has correctly predicted ice, snow, clear skies, clouds, rain, warming trends, and bitter cold even for this notoriously "don’t like the weather, wait ten minutes" part of the country. If it says a high chance of rain, I take an umbrella to work. If it says sunny, I don’t. I almost never get wet unless I ignore a forecast for rain. Doug
Response:
This isn’t exactly relevant to what you were saying, but it is a related subject. (I don’t often get a chance to talk about there things.) I was amazed at how incredibly easy it was to control the weather when I first did it. It was an expression of my own will rather than a ritualistic exercise. I wanted a beautiful clear day and I focused on the idea. The next day was perfect! Coincidence? Back then I was rather doubtful so I thought it probably was. To prove that I hadn’t really done it, I repeated the action. Another beautiful day! Dispite repeated sucess, I didn’t really believe I could do it until I melted a cloud, something a friend and fellow witch told me about. I still didn’t really believe until I expanded another immediatelly after. Then I was hooked. I played around, making clear skies and rain until I was yelled at. But that’s a different story. I really feel sorry for weathermen. They can’t possibly account for Witches. No wonder they’re often wrong.
Response:
simply wish 4 it
Response:
My area of the states are sadly in need of rain. Should I prayer to the Goddess or try a spell? And if I did do a spell, which I really feel is more of a request in the situation, does anyone know if such a spell exists? I feel really in the dark on this one.
I’m fairly sure such a spell exists, but you have to be careful. I’ve heard lots of stories of Witches casting weather spells with disasterous results. After 7 years of drought where I live, we had a year with *tons* of rain. It seems the natural cycle for drought followed by flood. If you do something, do be careful. I’d hate to see a flood with you standing around feeling guilty. b*b Brigid (in San Francisco where we’re over 100% of normal)
Response:
A "Rain" Incense 4 parts heather 1 part fern 1/2 part henbane* Burn out of doors(poisonous) to attract rain. #1 = A "Rain"Chant: energize water you have retrieved from a natural source{river,stream,spring} then take into your hands and throw upwards and chant :" Rain,rain,come our way.Fill our skies,refresh our lands,I give you the water from our hands" #2 = Chant : "Tiamat,Osiris,Mari,Neptune,Poseidon,Isis,bring your rains down upon our souls" {dance and/or drum to build energies and increase the tempo as your energies build} again burning with the above incense. #3 = As the previous idea of using a broom is a very old and long used custom it is a very good one,however you want to make sure the broom is wet and
Response:
My area of the states are sadly in need of rain. Should I prayer to the Goddess or try a spell? And if I did do a spell, which I really feel is more of a request in the situation, does anyone know if such a spell exists? I feel really in the dark on this one.
no comment untill now